Building A Brand That Matches Who You Really Are with Lorraine Schuchart (YouTube Transcript)
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (00:03)
Welcome back to Live the Width of Your Life podcast. This is a very special conversation because I have my dear friend Lorraine Schuchart here, and we're actually doing a joint podcast today about the things we're incredibly interested in and passionate about: alignment. So, Lorraine, welcome.
Lorraine Schuchart (00:25)
Thank you so much. I'm so excited for this conversation, Aneta, and of course, my podcast is called Brand for Good. And I help people align externally with their messaging and brand, while you do the inside work. And so there's a little bit of overlap because I talk about brand excavation as sole excavation, and we really go deep.
But I love the fact that in an ideal world, people would work with you and then work with me, and it would make my work so much easier and feel so natural to people.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (01:00)
That's so good. So you and I, the way this came to be, I love to provide the background, is we met on LinkedIn. And I am loving the new relationships that I've developed through LinkedIn, not because we were trying to sell something to one another. But I think just because we have mutual friends in common, we started really aligning with each other's messages. I got to come to a conference that you
put on that you facilitated, met you in person, which is always weird when you meet someone after like a year of following them. And then it was so awesome because you were exactly as I imagined that you would be, actually funnier, like all the professional and the wise and all the amazing things, and like super vibrant, but also really funny, which I appreciated that LinkedIn does.
Lorraine Schuchart (01:27)
Right? Thank you. Yeah,
I love that we're multifaceted, right? And so I am more serious in my writing, especially on LinkedIn. I want to be a trusted advisor, but I also want to be human and say that I'm here for relationships. And that's how we got to be friendly on LinkedIn. it was lovely to meet you in person, too. And I do feel like writing when it's from the heart, it does give you an accurate anticipation of who a person is, but then you see all the other facets of them in real life, which is such a joy.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (02:22)
It really is. It's so nice. And I'm so grateful that we have opportunities to be in person again, do more events and really build relationships outside of just Zoom or Teams. And so that's been a joy. And something that I'm holding myself accountable for is actually spending more time outside of online with people, especially with women this year.
Lorraine Schuchart (02:43)
Yes, me too. And it's really interesting because it wasn't a goal that I stated as a New Year's resolution or anything like that, but it was more of a tug.
I was being tugged to have more in-person conversations, or even like I call them virtual coffees. Getting on Zoom, if that's your only choice. I mean, it's been single digits here in Cleveland. So people are not really excited about going out, but you can still do the virtual coffees that are one-to-one and then meet people out as we break the freezing. Yeah, it's just been something that I just am really craving, and I think a lot of women are.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (03:21)
I would love for you to just share with my audience because if this is the first time that they're interacting with you or listening a little bit more about Prosper for Purpose it mean to be a brand strategist? What does it look like when people hire you, and they work with you?
Lorraine Schuchart (03:35)
Right, thank you. So Prosper for Purpose is my agency, and we talk about building category of one brands for individuals and organizations. And basically what that means is you're not the celebrity name necessarily, but what I love to do is work with my clients to find out what is unique about them and their business and help them articulate that in a way that they're the right people
that should be working with them can find them and distinguish them from all their peers in the market. And as an agency, working with us starts with really an understanding and an assessment of who you are, what your company is, what you stand for, and then looking at how that's currently showing up.
In your marketing and your online presence? What does the copy on your website look like? Are you saying publicly what you say in a conversation? And how do we pull the essence of what is so unique and special about you? I compare it to a recipe. Like we all have chocolate chip cookie recipes, right? But very few are the same. Some people add cinnamon, some people add oatmeal, some people add nuts, some people like them big and chewy, and other people like them thin and crispy. So everyone has their own recipe. So what's your unique recipe? And then from there, we figure out what are the platforms that they should show up on, where they're most likely to reach those people that they feel called to serve. And we help them do that. So my background is as a PR strategist, and I worked in corporate, and I worked in nonprofit, and I really loved the mission and being tied to that of a nonprofit, but I really loved the pace of working in a corporate setting because it really teaches people to trust their gut. If you make a mistake, you move forward, you don't get, you know, stalled. And I wanted to bring that intersection
to my business. So when I started my business in 2013, I decided to call it Prosper for Purpose. So do well so you can do more good. And that's what the name stands for. And so today we meet people along the way. Maybe they have a brand, and it is pretty well articulated, but they're not really out there. And we figure out is social media is your platform? Is Substack your platform? Should you be on podcasts and giving talks and things like that? And then we help them either implement that, or we create the strategy and hand it off to their team to implement.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (06:14)
Mm-hmm. That is so needed because I know when I first started my business, I just really struggled with what my brand is. I don't know if it's like, in corporate spending so much time there, you sort of, I felt like maybe I took on a persona that was going to allow me to be successful within that space. And then now saying, actually, who am I outside of that? And what is my voice, and how do I want to present myself, what do I actually even want to wear? Just like basic things. What platforms do I want to be on? Can I put myself out there when, before, we were told not to? All of those things that you talked about, they were just things that I sweat like I just didn't know what to do about them. And I still think today, I feel like this needs to be something that I'm going through again and again. You work with clients; do they come in for a tune-up?
Lorraine Schuchart (06:43)
Yes!
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (07:04)
Like every couple of years or so, what does that look like?
Lorraine Schuchart (07:04)
Yes. So my advice is every three years. And so what I tell people is you are a human being becoming. We're all evolving. So it is natural that your brand and your business will reflect that.
And so as you're going through your own changes every three years, you may do something significant, and you say, should this affect my brand? And sure, reaching out to someone that you trust to say either, yeah, we can tweak things a little bit or
No, you're good. This fits. And it really starts with building the right foundation. So I say prosper for purpose. I could bring so many other things into that. And I have plans to bring a couple of new services into my offerings, but it really encompasses what I stand for and what my business will stand for, regardless of the services that we offer. But
Every three years, we're just about ready to launch our new website. I've rewritten the copy to position us where we are now. It's actually been four years because this one's been a year in the making. But I think it's just really important to really take an assessment of yourself and your business and make sure it's aligned.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (08:18)
Yeah, it's and actually makes me feel the need to do this right now again, because I do feel we are changing constantly, and just saying, what identity am I stepping into? We learn a lot in the process. And so it seems like it's a timely conversation right now for me. But going back to when you decided to leave your career and start your own business. You were scared to do it, or was there a catalyst that prompted you to think, okay, maybe it's that I take a chance on myself?
Lorraine Schuchart (08:47)
Yeah, so I was a reluctant entrepreneur. I am that person who never dreamed of doing my own thing. However, throughout my career, I found myself freelancing. People would do this. Hey, could you write a radio spot for me? And I had a background in PR and advertising copywriting, and it was really interesting, and I think I was just so well served by that copywriting experience
So I went through my career freelancing, not wanting to be an entrepreneur. And where I ended up was I left a good job where I wasn't going to be able to make any more change. I felt like I kind of hit a wall, but I really liked it and went to a place where I thought I was going to be able to make a big change. And it ended up being a very toxic environment.
And I stayed way too long trying to protect my team and kind of shelter them from what was actually happening, and reached a point couldn't do that any longer. So
started planning my business, and ironically, I was asked to leave. They brought someone new in, and she had her own ideas about how she wanted to run things. And I was given a little parachute, it was very small, but it was just enough to start my business. I left in November of 2012 and launched my business in January 2013. And it was just really a godsend.
But I could have found another job, and I looked for another job while I was still there. I couldn't find a place I wanted to work. And my daughters both encouraged me, like you have this vision. You're always talking about what's wrong with nonprofits and what you would change about you would change about corporate. Why don't you just do that?
One of my daughters was through college, the other one was there. And so I just took a chance and did it. I thought I could always go back to work, but I found I really loved it. And my message of being a business that was using my work to create a positive impact in the world really resonated with people. And we got a lot of great clients right that first year, which was great.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (10:53)
It's so interesting you called an entrepreneur. I always felt that way myself, too, because I didn't want to stay in banking; I wasn't sure what was next. There was so much fear, I think, around entrepreneurship. I think I always felt maybe you had to be born that way or have a desire to take risks.
I think I looked around, and I was like, I don't think that any other place exists where I'd want to work. So let me just try this on my own. guess I would kind of call myself the same thing.
Lorraine Schuchart (11:23)
Love that. So I would love for you to talk a little bit about starting your business, what inspired you and why you chose the lane that you did.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (11:33)
Yeah, I was in corporate for 25 years, banking for 22. And I knew I didn't want to retire from it. My kids were finally at the age where one was in college, and one was going to college. And I did my MBA. Like I did all the stuff and I worked for amazing leaders. I had really cool projects, and I just looked around and I thought, I don't know. I just don't think that there's anything else here. But I wasn't sure. So I hired a coach and I think it was during
Lorraine Schuchart (11:48)
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (12:01)
the coaching phase, like I worked with my coach for six months and I just wanted to figure out, did I want to go into nonprofit? Because I was also like very mission driven, I want to help people. I want to feel there's a greater connection between the work that I do like seeing a change in someone's life. So I thought nonprofit, or is there a different industry? Maybe there's something else that allows me to also be creative because I feel like I was creative and I wanted to maybe leverage some of the other skills that
Lorraine Schuchart (12:17)
Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (12:28)
I didn't necessarily get to the time at work I fell in love with the coaching I'm such a I always loved learning. And so I loved assessments and I loved reflection and I loved all the journal prompts and I loved going deeper and creating a vision these just spoke to me so much.
And we did the work. was like, well, what would it look like if I were to have a coaching business? what would I want to focus on? And for me, since my twenties, I had practiced yoga and meditation for a really long time. I was always very curious about mindfulness, about Eastern practices. I had very strong, still have really strong faith, my own faith. And so really focusing in on just a strong spiritual connection to God.
Lorraine Schuchart (12:54)
you ⁓
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (13:15)
And knew I wanted to write books. Like I've always wanted to write books. I loved traveling. So I thought, wow, it be great to maybe do retreats. So the more I opened myself up to what could this actually be, the more excited I got. And when I wrote my vision statement, I was equal parts excited and then also terrified because I'm like, OK, none of this exists. None of it. None of it. Like, OK, this is going to be a big uphill battle. How am I going to
Lorraine Schuchart (13:36)
Yes.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (13:43)
get all the coaching certifications and get certified in things that I'm not certified to teach at. None of it existed. And then my coach was like, you know, you don't have to do it all today. You don't have to quit your job and do it. You can build this at the same time as you are continuing to work. And that idea of it doesn't have to be either or, could be non-binary. It could just decide yes, and.
Lorraine Schuchart (13:55)
you
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (14:07)
That was really appealing to me because I do not actually take a lot of risks in my life. And so I started yoga teacher training right away. Actually, once I made the decision that this is what I was going to do, don't know if this was your experience, but suddenly doors open, opportunities came faster than I thought I was even ready. I felt it was like the train had left the station and I was holding on.
Lorraine Schuchart (14:25)
Yes.
You better have
fun. I love it.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (14:32)
Dear life. Yes, I'm hopping on, holding on for dear life.
And it was just happening so quickly. And of course, at the same time, getting promoted at work, more people, bigger projects, all this stuff. And I don't think that God's testing us, but I definitely felt like, yes, I'll take it and I'll do a great job, but I'm still building this because
this doesn't actually motivate me. That's not what's going to motivate me to stay. I'm not going to change my mind. I waited two years. Yeah. October is a big transformation month for me. October is like when I started coaching. a year later when I started yoga teacher training. October is when I resigned from my job. So it's interesting just the change of leaves and the season and all this stuff.
That's what happened. then I started my business. My last day at work was January 7th, 2019. And then two days later, my LLC was active and there you go. ⁓
Lorraine Schuchart (15:22)
Nope.
I love it. I love it.
That is so interesting. There's so many things that you said that resonated with me. So I've always called myself a word nerd. I've always my nose in a book or been writing. And so the writing part, I always had to have work where I was writing. And I thought PR was a great career choice because I'd be telling other people's stories. But I also related to really wanting to help and really wanting to go deep with people. so clear and
everything that you write and how you work and I have listened to your podcast and that comes through so clearly and I think you and I aligning it's so weird now that I'm using that word how often I was already using it in just general conversation but you and I aligning on
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (16:13)
Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (16:17)
peace does come from living a life in alignment. And if you're a business owner, that includes your business. And so love and wonder sometimes I'm a person of faith as well. I think we've talked about that, but I faced something similar when I wanted to give up
PR as a core service. And so we still do PR, but we do real PR with our clients. Whereas about a third of our business was coming from people that wanted publicity.
And we were doing that and you and I, I think talked about this, but the media industry has drastically changed over the past five years. You have people that aren't living in the same city as the publications they write for and people that are doing three part-time gigs as journalists to make ends meet. And it's just not the same. And I didn't want to represent that as something that we can work with you for
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (17:12)
Mm.
Lorraine Schuchart (17:15)
three months and we'll get you featured in these top five publications because it didn't work that way. It's a long-term investment and you have to have the right story and people just wanted that dopamine hit of getting in a publication and so I made a very difficult decision to say we're not doing that as standalone service and start turning clients away but I do feel because we started getting more clients just as you talked about getting promoted we started getting
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (17:44)
Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (17:45)
more people coming to us. And I actually said in a prayer, God, are you telling me I should stay with this or are you really testing me to see how bad, or aligned I am with my own integrity of not feeling this is right to take. And of course I felt like it was the latter, but it was hard. It was hard to say no. When all of a sudden there's even an uptick in people that want just that.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (17:51)
Thank
Yeah, you know why I think it's because we've been taught that indicators are things like promotion, more money, more clients, these external validation. think we just grew accustomed that those are the markers of success or if things are going right or whatever. But I think it's that internal voice and it's connecting to the feeling and really getting grounded and centered.
Lorraine Schuchart (18:16)
Yes.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (18:34)
Even if we think we want something sometimes and really saying, how do I feel about this or what's the lesson or what am I learning here? I think the more that I do more authentic I am in my choices and my decisions and things. And even if sometimes people are like, shouldn't you be disappointed by that? And I'm like, maybe, but I'm actually It does mind trick, right?
And I have a recent thing that just happened. I by a company to do a speech in March and I was so excited. Looked like we were going to go through it. They just had to sign the contract and all the stuff. And then this morning, actually, right before we're recording, they were like, we met and we decided to go in a different direction. And I'm like, okay. Yeah. And it's like soon. So I was like, okay.
Lorraine Schuchart (18:56)
does.
my gosh.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (19:18)
And so maybe I'll get a response, maybe I won't. It was just kind of a weird thing. And I just sat with it for a little bit and I was like, how do we feel about this? And anytime I look back in my life, I just go, I'm just being redirected to something else. I can't really do much about it. can maybe get some information about, I know the proposal was great. I know was a professional fee, all those things.
Lorraine Schuchart (19:32)
I love that.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (19:41)
And I think the old me would probably have been like, oh my gosh, I shouldn't have asked that much or I should be whatever. And now I don't have that response anymore. And I think that that is just the more you practice being in alignment and more trust and surrender to God for me, it just, it really, takes away a lot of that noise. I don't know if you have like a similar or maybe if you have a story like that too.
Lorraine Schuchart (19:57)
Yes.
I do, and I think it's really important. think part of it for me is alignment. I hate to say this, but part of the wisdom that comes with which you only get.
after years of working. So it's not directly related to age, but it is related to the breadth and depth of experiences that you've had that you can start looking back and seeing, well, this has happened before. have had a client that's decided to go in new direction only to realize sometimes six months down the road that that was a client that was really sapping a lot of
my emotional energy. For whatever reason, they were changing direction all the time, which is usually what it is, or they were treating me like I was supposed to work in a silo, which has occasionally happened, or, we hired you to do this. Well, yes, but we need to work together. And sometimes you find that no matter how
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (20:47)
Mm-hmm.
Lorraine Schuchart (21:05)
clear you believe you are with expectations and you have the conversation and it's in writing. People hear what they want to hear and they move forward and then you both have a choice. Is this relationship going to work or not? But I always look at it as
It's not my plan, it's God's plan. I find the surrender in that as well. And it's not meant to be because I'm meant to be doing something else. And it doesn't even always mean that a better client is around the corner. Sometimes it means that I need to focus on
a different part of my business, working on the business. Or right now, I think I mentioned before we got on, I'm involved in a community project that's trying to push back on some land development that's happening where I live. requiring some energy. So where does that space come from, right? And so I think we all do that. And I think it's important when something that you initially perceive as negative
you look for what does this allow for me, right? And maybe this just wasn't meant for me. But I love how you frame everything. So I want to hear how your clients work with you a little more, because we've only talked about this stuff casually. So I want to hear all about when clients come into your world, what that looks like.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (22:15)
I know.
Yeah. it's interesting because if I were to say, okay, who is my ideal client and kind of talk in those terms, but I'll give you examples of typically when people come to me. So I work with men and women. People always ask, do you just work with women? And I say, no, I've actually had some amazing male clients. And typically they have been that have worked with me in the past in some capacity I've already built some credibility with them, but they've been paying attention.
Lorraine Schuchart (22:42)
Yeah
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (22:47)
they'll been reading your stuff on LinkedIn for the last seven years. And I'm like, who knew? Yeah, you don't even know. You don't know who's paying attention or who you're impacting or who your post maybe was inspiring to. And they're just waiting for the moment when they feel ready to reach out. that's typically how I work with men and women. I would say that probably the majority of the people are in
Lorraine Schuchart (22:51)
Wow, yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (23:11)
maybe we would call it midlife. I call it the prime of our life, you know, where, you've had work experience and life experience and enough confidence and wisdom to start questioning whether the life that you're living is really the one that you want to live for the rest of the time. so that's been probably 40 to 60 is kind of been the age I would say if on average, but really people come to me because if
Lorraine Schuchart (23:13)
Right. Yeah.
Okay.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (23:38)
they want to stay where they are. They might be struggling with some burnout. They also could be struggling with confidence issues, maybe they were promoted and they've been successful their entire career and all of a sudden they have moved into a new role or a new department or a new leader and something feels fairly uncomfortable, unknown. they usually will use the words like imposter syndrome, which I actually don't like and I don't
Lorraine Schuchart (23:43)
Yeah.
with
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (24:05)
perpetuate that identity. don't like us taking on those types of labels or identities. And so that's kind of a group of people. And then sometimes people come in, they're me and where they say, I don't want to do this anymore. And they've already made a decision it is such a knowing so deep in their bones that they are not staying, but they don't know what to do next because they haven't spent most of their life figuring that out. They've always been
Lorraine Schuchart (24:17)
you
Yes.
Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (24:31)
the good corporate employee doing what was them, and then they reach a point for various reasons, right? And so they're having a little bit of an identity struggle, like who am I outside of this role and wanting to get some really clear vision around what do I wanna do? And maybe it's because they wanna retire early, maybe it's just because they can't imagine staying for another 10 to 15 years, whatever it is.
Lorraine Schuchart (24:35)
Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (24:56)
And then I also do a lot of business coaching. have a lot of new entrepreneurs or folks who have chosen to leave corporate. Maybe they already worked with me in the past, figuring out what they want to do. They want to start their own business and not sure exactly where to begin. So pulling in lots of business experience on, how do I start a new business? What does it look like? How do I take it? Make sure that's aligned to what's most important to me, what I want to deliver. So I would say those are probably the three.
ways or the types of clients that come to me. But I purposely got certified in life coaching, executive coaching, health and wellness and business because I wanted to pull all that in with the mindfulness, with the meditation, with the yoga, all of those things to be able to customize programs for people exactly where they are. And so we work on their whole self, not just their career, maybe their mindset, but really
let's look at all of your life and let's figure out what is your baseline? what does success even look like? What are your values? What does it mean to live in alignment and do some of that work? love it so much because it's like the work that matters. And when you get so clear on that, anything is possible. Like literally anything is possible. I tell all my clients, I really believe it.
Lorraine Schuchart (26:11)
I think that's beautiful. think you do a lot of the excavation
that I do, but on a different level. And so when people come to me, we do look at their childhood. had someone come to me once and say, I know you want to find something unique about me, but there's really nothing. And I said, OK, challenge accepted. Let's let's let's talk about who you are and who you were before you started your business. And he went on to say, well,
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (26:29)
Ugh.
Lorraine Schuchart (26:40)
my parents moved around a lot when I was a kid. I lived in like five different countries and I was like, whoa, stop right there. Let's unpack that because you understand most people don't grow up living and cultures. And that gives you experience and a lens that came from that that other people in your space do not have.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (26:47)
That's typical.
Lorraine Schuchart (27:04)
And he was like, I never thought about that because we don't see what's special in ourselves. We're not trained that way. We're trained to be humble. I do occasionally. Well, not any longer. I've been very clear about who I work with. But in the first couple of years, I would have people come to me saying, well, just promote me. I'm a really interesting person. I actually had two or three people say that to me. And then they would tell me their story from their perspective of what was interesting. And I didn't
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (27:10)
Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (27:31)
feel it was terribly interesting, but that's okay.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (27:35)
Yeah,
I love that. And it's interesting because we want the business to be a reflection of who we are. Right? And the work that you do allows people to tap into that and to step into who they are, I guess more authentically, because it's not what we were taught. Even if you took branding classes, like what is your brand within corporate, you're still building a brand within
Lorraine Schuchart (27:42)
Yes.
Bye.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (27:59)
the culture and the confines of the organization that you're working in. I mean, all of it. And so how wonderful for you to help people, I think it's like a form of freedom to be able to step into that and be like, this is who I am. This is my voice. is how I speak. How do I refine that to be attractive to the clients that I wanna work with? How do I?
Lorraine Schuchart (28:04)
Absolutely. Yeah.
100%.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (28:21)
⁓
be a magnet for the people that naturally will gravitate towards me because I always tell my clients like coaching is a very intimate relationship. You're going to talk to this person. You're going to share things you're not going to share with your boss, with your coworkers, with your friends. You don't want to talk to your spouse, your partner about all these things. They don't want to listen to it always either. But your coach is someone you should trust and you should want to engage and have these conversations. So
of course you want the coach to be who they are and their best version too. And then that's a much better match than, pretending to be something you're not. And then it never really quite works out.
Lorraine Schuchart (28:59)
100%. I think, it's like trying on shoes, whether you're finding a coach or a therapist or a hairdresser. mean, there's so many times it's like, there's nothing wrong with this other person and their clients love them and think they're the best of the best, but they may not be the right fit for you. And that's why I think it's so incumbent upon business owners to be really clear about
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (29:05)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Lorraine Schuchart (29:24)
their personality and their values and what they stand for and what they stand against so that people by the time they go to work with them are 80 to 90 sure that this is the right person and then it makes it so much easier for both people.
The other thing that you touched on that I just want to pin for a minute is the idea of brand. And you said it without saying it, but most people think brand is what they hire someone to create for them. And it's not. Brand is distilling of the essence of the person, determining how much of that you want to bring and show up in your business because
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (29:55)
Mm.
Lorraine Schuchart (30:06)
we don't bring every single facet of us to our business, nor should we, which doesn't mean we're not authentic, but it just means things that are personal. But your brand is everything you create and how you show up in the world determined by how people perceive and engage with it. So when I take someone through a branding process,
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (30:11)
God.
Lorraine Schuchart (30:30)
We go through it shows up on the inside. Like how do you show up even if you don't have a team yet? What is the culture of your organization? All the inside work first, just like you, but it's within the company. And then what is the perception we're going through and how do we build a customer experience and or a public persona
that exemplifies that. at the end of the day, our brand, is our reputation, that's the final answer, is that overlap of what we've created and how people engage with it, because that's the real test.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (31:06)
Yeah, it's so good. I love that you said that distilling the essence of who you And think that's why it's so hard for us to try to do that for ourselves. I remember going through reading a lot of stuff and taking courses and I didn't know you back then, but you know, try to piece it together. And even now, as you think about identity changing and identity shifts, which I want to talk to you think that's why it's so important to
Lorraine Schuchart (31:21)
Thank
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (31:30)
come back to it again, like you said, every three years or so. So for me in coaching, I always tell you want to make another big leap shift, elevation, whatever that is in your business and who you are and how you show up in the world, it is an identity shift first. And you have to see yourself in that place and then all of your choices and decisions.
Lorraine Schuchart (31:34)
Right.
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (31:56)
should align to where you are going. And that could mean wearing different clothes. It could mean new healthy habits that are going to support the person that you are becoming. It could mean making investments that maybe you aren't prepared to make yet, but you know that are going to be necessary to get to where you want to go. It could mean a refresh, of the way the world externally views you. So tell me about
how you talk about identity. And if someone comes to you and says, you know what, been in business for the last seven years, say it's me, and here's where I see myself going, here's where I see the next 10 years, how would you help them to really say, okay, this is the new identity or how we elevate from where you currently are today?
Lorraine Schuchart (32:43)
I love that you're asking that and I love that this is yet another parallel because I tell my clients that their brand is always somewhat aspirational. then I always talk to them about how do you become the person your dreams require? How do you become the business that your dreams require?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (32:47)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Lorraine Schuchart (33:06)
Maybe
if you were only working four days a week, you need to work six days a week for a while. I am not fan of hustle culture. However, there are times in every business where the owner needs to hustle. And it's usually when you want to get to a new elevation, you have to
start from scratch in many, many ways. So when I am doing this from a brand perspective, I also do it from a growth perspective because I know what it means to grow. I am not a business coach.
But I am saying to be perceived like this and to make this, what are the day to day things in your business that need to change? We talk about scheduling. We talk about how to build in time to do the new kind of content, to do the new positioning, to go back to old clients and get perspectives from them. When I'm doing one on one branding, I interview people's clients.
Because like you said, you cannot read the label from inside the container, nor can I. So I work with a couple of partners when I'm leveling up. I talk to my clients, my more recent clients, and the ones that I've had for a long time to say, how has our relationship changed? How have you seen me change? Because it's not just coming from me, it's coming through me.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (34:02)
Hmm.
Lorraine Schuchart (34:25)
And people have perspectives that can strengthen mine. So I do work a little bit more holistically when people are leveling up their identity. And that's when we look at, did they build the right foundation to begin with?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (34:42)
Mmm.
Lorraine Schuchart (34:43)
Sometimes I'm trying to think of an example. just say that you have a restaurant And you have different restaurants with different personalities. But what you really want to do is build in
nutrition consulting. Maybe one of your restaurants is based on healthy eating. And as a side of that, the owner has really gotten into, because we know people in the restaurant business, they don't eat well, they don't sleep well. So maybe this person has gone through an evolution. And so we have to go back to the foundation of their brand. And we might have to make some significant changes to the brand at that point. And that is an identity shift.
But the owner's already gone through the identity shift himself or herself. And now we're taking that and saying, how do we share And there's a lot of great opportunity when an owner goes through a shift. And hopefully they'll have worked with someone like you to understand that. But then when they come to me, it's like, OK.
So here's the personal story we're going to tell about why you're making this shift. Here's where that story needs to be, including on their website. Like if they're changing their brand foundation, that's a bigger lift than just elevating to the next level.
And so we look at that from a holistic lens. What does this mean for your brand? What does this mean from the other brands within, we have an architecture. So you have a parent brand and you may have child brands like your retreats. You may brand as a child brand within your company. It won't be all your clients that are interested in that, but there's a group. The same thing with this restaurant group that's now going into nutrition consulting.
There will be a subset, probably the people that hang out at that one particular restaurant, but it won't be their entire market. And so that's an identity shift that we help clients make, usually not that drastically, but occasionally. And it's really starting brand foundation built to expand in the beginning?
Was it an umbrella that it can encompass change or was it very specific in which case we have to look at is this an expansion or is this actually a new parent. A second parent. And hopefully that answered that question.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (37:02)
Yeah,
no, I love that so much. There are so similarities here. I love it. And of course there are because we're talking about human And we're still trying to, as you said, distill the essence of who we are. curious how your definition of success has changed over the years. Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (37:19)
Drastically. Drastically.
started out, when I was in school, was told, go into PR and you can go into nonprofit, or if you want to make a difference, you will go into nonprofit. And if you want to ascend a corporate ladder and have the typical trappings of success, you go into corporate. And I thought, well, I want to make a difference. So I went into nonprofit and I spent
time working in nonprofit and was elevated, was actually offered in my mid-twenties the role of executive director, which I turned down to take a different job in corporate. And within three years of working in corporate, I tripled the salary that I left at my nonprofit. I was like, well, this is good. This enables me to have a child, buy a house, those kinds of things. And
I found that I went back and forth over my work together. And I think that pursuing that, finding out what success really means, and for me, it was...
I couldn't reconcile the two. And that's what I realized when I started my business. But then even then I got in the trappings. I told my husband early on, I want to have an office that's in a community where we have a storefront. I want to be part, physically part of the community. And so after a couple of years, we found a space, we rented it, we outgrew it. My team grew. I thought...
I want a team of 10 to 15 people. That's what I want. That feels good to me. I don't want to have 50 people. I don't want to build big. I want to build small and intimate. So my husband and I bought a building that had a storefront that was like two and a half times the size of the space that we had rented. And I had the team of 10 and I owned the building and COVID hit. And so
there was really a lot of reckoning as to what's really important. No one could come into the office, obviously. I went. It was a lot of space for one person. And so the end of 2021, my team had gotten smaller. I had to make some tough decisions. Some of them were hybrid. I had two interns that had been working for me.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (39:19)
Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (39:31)
in two different states that when we went into lockdown I said you can stay as long as you need to you're not going be able to find your first job they were both graduating they were last term seniors you can stay as long as you want because you're not going be able to find your first job unless you have a job and so if you stay here even a year you'll have had your first job and they both did that but the bigger thing was I realized that the big team was fun but
wasn't how I imagined it to be. And in fact, after the team shrank, we actually had our best year in business because the people who remained were more experienced. And that was really hard for me because my identity was wrapped up in giving people their first jobs. But I realized that
it had really hurt the bottom, not only the bottom line, but even the top line of the business, because it was taking a lot more time to get things done. And so I restructured that.
The bigger one was that my husband and I had always dreamed of having a cottage on Lake Erie where we could go in the summer to a summer place where we had gone for years. And he said to me, we could sell the building and get the cottage. And I said done. And he looked at me and he's like, are you sure? You've talked about this building for a very long time. So my idea of success changed
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (40:45)
Okay.
Lorraine Schuchart (40:53)
because of experience, but also because of the pandemic. And I think for a lot of people, their idea of success changed because they went through something very scary that made them rethink what really mattered.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (41:06)
Absolutely. I think that was a reckoning for so many of us. It's because we had to get still enough to ask ourselves those questions. And when some of the things are taken away that you thought you absolutely needed or were so important, then you could just sit there and go, wait a second, is this really all that important?
Does this matter or what am I gaining here instead? And I think we gained so much during that time. just thought, wow, I love having dinner with my family and I love spending more time outside in my backyard and I think that my morning walks and just being outside and really relishing that and just being so grateful for it because it was something that wasn't taken away was just really important. But I also think with time,
we can ask ourselves those things. And sometimes you have to achieve the things that you thought that you wanted in order to say, ⁓ wow, I actually don't feel the way that I thought that I would. Yeah. And then that's where you go, what was I actually chasing? What was the feeling that I thought that I would get from this? And it's like,
Lorraine Schuchart (42:05)
Yes. Yes.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (42:17)
time in the summer, that feels amazing, right? It's the freedom to be able to work from anywhere and working with great people. Maybe it's higher profit. Who knows all those things like we get to decide. And I think that when we start asking ourselves the questions, and this is a lot of the work I do with my clients is what does success mean to you? Because it's so important because then all of our choices that we
Lorraine Schuchart (42:27)
Right.
Mmm, so important.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (42:43)
They're either going to be aligned to that or they're not. And don't be surprised that if you're making decisions and choices based on someone else's expectations or definitions of success, if you're miserable, if you're burned out, if you're exhausted, if you're not having a great time, those things are going to happen. when you make the small shift and you go, wow, I didn't realize how important it was for me to just be able to sit and have, eat my lunch in peace with no
meetings and just be able to hang out with the dog or whatever the things are. Those are the little things that add up to being the big things.
Lorraine Schuchart (43:17)
I think this, and let me know what you think. I also think because I loved having the team at the time and I loved having my building and we were part of the community and we would be outside and people would stop by. But I started to think of it like this and tell me if this makes sense. I have always wanted to travel to certain places in the world and I've gone there and I've never been disappointed. I've loved the experience, but I didn't want to stay there.
I went for the experience and once I had it, I realized as great as it was, it didn't need to have it forever. So I'm so grateful that I had the team that I did. And I'm so grateful that we had that building and we're part of the community, but I didn't need to have them forever. Does that make sense?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (44:02)
Yeah, of course. home. And like you said, it was more of an experience you learn from it. You can look back on it fondly. Doesn't mean it was a mistake. I mean, I say that all the I tell people because sometimes we think, I wish I'd left sooner. I wish I'd taken a chance on myself. And I say, but nothing is wasted. If you really believe that nothing is wasted, that you can use every good or bad or challenging experience
for good going forward, you will see it as such and you will be able to capitalize on all of those things. So it's, and you're just going to be a happier person if you think that, and if you approach life that way, like, okay, I learned from it. That's okay. I don't regret it.
Lorraine Schuchart (44:40)
Thank you.
Yeah. Let me ask you this. Do you work with all your clients one-to-one? I know you also do retreats. Can you talk about like how you work with different clients?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (44:53)
Yeah,
I do one on one. And then I also do lot of corporate programs. So I love to work with organizations, either virtually or in person and really customize programs based on what it is that they need. During COVID, I started doing a lot of resilience programs or focusing in on all things topics related to like the individual than the team than the organization. I think that too often we've gone through like leadership
training or focusing in on things that are just benefit. Maybe the organization still the leader, but more tied towards like that lens. And I love creating programs where it's like, let's focus on you. How do you become the best version of yourself? So you show up as that person at home and at work to be the leader for your team, then set that tone. And then of course, in alignment to the overall corporate
Lorraine Schuchart (45:34)
Thank you. ⁓
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (45:49)
goals and being able to teach people how to be more resilient, how to give themselves permission to focus on the things that are needed, focusing in under health, whatever it just really allows me to scale in a larger way too and also see that the people are really happy and their companies are happy. And then I do retreats, which I love to do because it
combines my love of travel and curating wonderful experiences with pulling yoga, the meditation, the coaching, curating these wonderful experiences. And I love doing retreats because I think that when we are put in uncomfortable situations, meaning we're not at home, we're broader space with other people that we may not know, where sometimes we're...
Lorraine Schuchart (46:36)
right?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (46:37)
traveling by ourselves or maybe with someone else. But that's where real transformation happens. Because you're not going to go and go do your email or go do laundry or kind of distract yourself with these things. You're going to be in an environment that is all about growth and transformation or focusing in on yourself. So I love doing retreats. going to Croatia, doing two in Croatia.
With a friend of mine this time. So I won't have to facilitate just on my own, which is great, but we're doing two weeks, which is so fun. yeah, so the first one is co-ed. She lives in Croatia, so she's got a lot of European clients and I'm bringing some Americans. The second week is all women. So it's going to be pretty awesome. She's a psychotherapist, so she's going to do a lot of inner child healing and I'll bring in and do a lot of
Lorraine Schuchart (47:10)
Wow, that's great.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (47:27)
mindfulness and coaching circles and visioning as well as somatic breath and yoga. Then we'll do some fun things that you can do like island hop and all of those things. I did Morocco last year, I did Portugal twice, I've done Tuscany, so Ireland, Northern Ireland, it's just so fun. And every retreat is different because of the location. So what you're doing, and the people.
Lorraine Schuchart (47:46)
Yeah, that's amazing.
And because of the people, right? Because the chemistry of people,
right?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (47:53)
Chemistry people and the people who want to go to Northern Ireland and be in the forest all the time and with horses or whatever are different than the people who want to be in Marrakesh and Morocco maybe, or versus Tuscany in a so I think that the location and then the people that are naturally gravitate towards it what I curate in terms of the entire experience, it's just like a unique
Lorraine Schuchart (48:05)
⁓ true. Yeah.
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (48:21)
everyone so it's like a unique retreat, I think based on all that. Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (48:25)
Who attends these retreats? Are they people that have been previous clients or do you get a lot of people that you haven't even talked to before that decide they wanna participate?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (48:36)
think that I've ever had anyone that I didn't know unless it was a client or a friend who was coming that was inviting someone that they were close to. Yeah, so it's typically people that have been in my community, or a friend or a past colleague or, it's interesting. Even now I just ran into someone
Lorraine Schuchart (48:45)
Okay, that makes sense. Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (48:58)
had met back in 2007 at an event and she said, where are you going this year? Like it was just so casual. And I said, I'm going to Croatia. She's like, my God, that's been on my bucket list. Let me reach out to our other friend who's another past someone I used to work with. And they registered like within two days. And then I saw two friends at church this weekend and, he's like, do you have a cowed one? He's like, I think my wife and I want to come. I'm like,
Lorraine Schuchart (49:06)
That's so great. Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (49:25)
Okay, yeah, the first one. So you just never know sometimes where in who's paying attention to the stories or the posts or the newsletter and they're just waiting for the right time to say, you know what, think I'm going to do this.
Lorraine Schuchart (49:27)
great.
Love that. Do you have a favorite story of a client, whether from retreat or, a personal coaching client that you think really exemplifies the work that you do? I know that's a tough question to be put on the spot with.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (49:54)
Gosh, you know what don't know if I have a favor, but I'm trying to think of some interesting ones. I will tell you, this one is funny I have worked with young adults. I have such a really soft spot for young adults, but my first client was my investment banker at the time, his son.
And he had sent him to me because his son wanted to make a change in terms of college and all these things. But he didn't know why. And so he'd like left So I worked with him. And what I found out was that he was in a major that he didn't want. He was pre-med,
Lorraine Schuchart (50:23)
Yeah.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (50:33)
and only because he was really smart, really good at school. somebody, his counselor and others told him that this was going to be a good choice for him. And when we spent some time doing the work asking like, what is your future look like? What do you actually want to do? At the end of the day, he wanted to have a family. He wanted to coach his kids, softball games. He wanted to be home for dinner
all the time. Money wasn't like a big motivator. We just really got to wait a second, being a physician would definitely not allow you to do all these things that were so core to who you are and what you wanted. And then when we started to dig a little bit deeper about what he really enjoyed as a young person, because we always leave clues of what we enjoy.
Lorraine Schuchart (50:59)
⁓
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (51:19)
loved taking things apart, putting them back together, super curious, inquisitive. had him enroll in a local school for a semester, take a couple of different types of classes based on some other options. Loved engineering. And then in the fall sign up at a local school that was closer. It was only a couple of hours away because he didn't want to be as far away as he was.
Lorraine Schuchart (51:42)
That makes sense.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (51:43)
and
And was able to sign up in the major that he wanted. I think financially it made more sense than even where he was before. And it was just one of those examples of like, if you just ask the right questions, we know the answers. They're always within us. It's just that we don't ask the right questions. And this is similar at any age. In this case, you've got a guidance counselor who's probably responsible for 300, 400 kids. Who knows, right? At a high school
Lorraine Schuchart (52:09)
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (52:10)
they can never go deep enough. They're gonna say, oh, well, it looks like you're pretty good at math and science. You're a great student. Why don't you just become a doctor and bunch of money. And it's like, that's not necessarily what we want. adults, I always have such a soft spot for them, probably because I have adult children and it's really important to get to those types of questions. And then, similar story.
Lorraine Schuchart (52:16)
Exactly.
.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (52:33)
Another friend someone that I knew and sent me his spouse and we worked together and started off for stress management and burnout. And then it turned into their job was eliminated. And so suddenly at an age where he thought, wow, I'm going to retire from this place. And I'm going to make
Lorraine Schuchart (52:53)
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (52:55)
I think we have these dreams, like I'm going to just work this many more years, retire, et cetera. And then suddenly say, well, who am I outside of this role that I've been in for decades? And what do I do now? What are my transferable skills? What are those things that I can bring forward? focused first on taking care of the stress of the burnout and really the impact to their
nervous system they've been stressed that they were under and then started going and digging a little bit deeper into what really mattered. love where they are right now. They are thriving. They're doing fantastic. They love everything about it. I still keep in touch with them. just an example that one, it's never too late to make a change two, just because you've done something
Lorraine Schuchart (53:31)
Bye!
Right.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (53:44)
I don't care how long, for decades, it doesn't mean that that's the only thing that you can do if it doesn't bring you joy. And three, you can absolutely step into a new identity and figure out what that is at any age. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. I think that those things just bring me so much joy and satisfaction because that's what my coach gave me.
Lorraine Schuchart (54:06)
I love
that.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (54:07)
In my late 40s when I worked with her and that's what I love doing with others. And I would say you're able to do that in older age and you have the wisdom and you have the experience and you've got hopefully some support and you've made some good decisions when you were younger that gives you a little bit more freedom and flexibility, it's incredible what we're able to do and the impact in world.
Lorraine Schuchart (54:28)
I love that you...
Yes, yes, yes. No, I'm really struck by you said that we can change at any age because my first thought was, well, we already are changing at every age. And so why not get perspective on what that could mean for our life? And I think about
changing from being a single person working to having children and trying to balance that to becoming an empty nester. And I don't know if you're an empty nester yet or not, but we have moved since my girls ⁓ went away, but I used to keep their bedroom doors closed. My first one went away to college and I couldn't bear to walk by her room. So I kept the door closed. My second one went away to college three years later. I had both rooms closed.
I could not bear to open the door and go in those rooms. My transition from having children to being an empty nester was one of the hardest transitions I ever went through. And I think it makes so much sense to have a touchstone, a person, that you can talk to as you're making those changes. Like, I had this huge space in my life open up.
I had all this love that I've been pouring into two people that were no longer part of my day-to-day life. What do I do with that? Well, I ended up getting dogs, but that's a story for another day. a caretaker. So I was like, oh, but lots of other things as well. But having guidance then probably would have been
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (55:43)
Yeah.
Lorraine Schuchart (55:52)
really helpful. I didn't talk to a therapist because I thought, well, this is normal. Then of course, later you find out some people are very happy when their kids go away to school, not because they didn't love them, but they feel like they can finally get on with their own life, which is also true, it's a both end. ⁓ But I love that you said that because that makes so much sense. And that's how I feel about business. You're always changing.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (56:07)
Yep.
Lorraine Schuchart (56:15)
So if you're not reflecting that in your business in some way, there might be an and it might start feeling stressful and you might start feeling burned out because you're no longer in alignment.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (56:26)
Yeah, that's so true. Lorraine, I've just enjoyed our conversation so much and I do ask ⁓ a final question and maybe you have one for your podcast too, but what does it mean to you to live the width of your life?
Lorraine Schuchart (56:36)
Yeah.
I think living the width of my life means that I examining it from a perspective, not a 10,000 foot view because I can't clearly on that. But I really want to make sure that I'm putting in the big rocks first.
And so that comes from where I spend my emotional time, where I spend my physical time when I can. My girls are, one's in Manhattan and one's in Honolulu. And of course I'm here in Cleveland, Ohio. So the physical time is not always available to me.
But I do that and I reassess on a regular basis. And to me, that's really important because we can get out of alignment. I can say, well, my biggest rock is my relationship with my husband. But then I find, gosh, we have not had any one-on-one time in like three days. And then you have to reassess, well, am I being true? Am I living in alignment to what I say is most important?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (57:35)
Yeah. so good. So, so good. Well, I am just so grateful for our time together. And if people want to work with you, what's the best way that they can get a hold of you?
Lorraine Schuchart (57:45)
They can reach out to me through the prosperforpurpose.com website or just send me an email or connect with me on LinkedIn. So I'll give you those can put them in the show notes and I'll flip that question to you and then I'll ask you a last question.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (58:02)
Yeah, if anyone wants to work with me, they can go to my website because you'll get links to everything there, including my books and the services that I offer. So anetacusma.com. And I'm also very active on LinkedIn and Instagram too, but I would say, mostly LinkedIn. And then of course you might find some videos of the podcast on YouTube.
Lorraine Schuchart (58:21)
Yeah, that's great. So as you look at your life, and this is kind of a broad question too, what do you want your legacy to be?
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (58:30)
I think I want my legacy to be that I just loved people, that I used every skill, gift, and experience that God gave me, good, bad, challenging, and that I was able to turn it into something useful and helpful for others so that they can live the width of their life. I see myself as a vessel for God to work through, and when I remember that, then I kind of get out of my own way
and release all the stuff takes up too much space and that prevents, I think, God to work through me. That's what my legacy hopefully will be.
Lorraine Schuchart (59:05)
That's beautiful think that is something that I would write down and probably post somewhere for myself because that was so beautiful. It was so beautiful. I love it so much. And thank you for having this important conversation with me. I feel like this was a conversation that did go deep.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (59:15)
Aww.
Lorraine Schuchart (59:26)
It wasn't just, about our business, but you and I have really found so much in common in how we approach our work and how we look at life, that I hope we will continue this conversation.
Aneta Ardelian Kuzma (59:39)
Absolutely. Thank you, Lorraine.
Lorraine Schuchart (59:41)
Thank you, Aneta