How Paralegals Are Quietly Rewriting the Justice System (YouTube Transcript)
Aneta (00:01.998)
Fatima, thanks to you so much for joining me today. I'm so excited to have you here.
Fatima (00:07.61)
I'm excited to be here, and thank you for having me.
Aneta (00:10.486)
Of course, I love being able to meet new people. And when I saw your profile, and I was looking at all the things that you are doing, it's so inspiring. And I know that one of the ways that you define yourself and your bio is as a legal disruptor. And you've created solutions called movement rides. So tell me a little bit more about kind of your background and your passion and how you started doing the things that you're doing today.
Fatima (00:40.482)
So my passion is in constitutional law, paralegal, and immigration. And I think my passion started when I founded the Harmony Initiative last year in the midst of a write-in campaign. I was running for office as a write-in, and I had a mentor who thought, Marla, why don't you do something different?
Why don't you be the one who causes people not to take sides and be the one who harmonizes rather than conflicts in politics? And I started thinking about that, and he kept on hammering on me. When you take sides, you don't have a conversation, and then you don't get anything done.
And you just conflict, and then people are just divided and polarized. And so it took me a whole year of transforming and wrapping myself around harmony and the movement for restoring dignity, justice, and harmony in civic life. And so in the midst of my divorce, I created the movement rights and the first of its kind,
mobile legal clinics that provide safe rides to courts and access to legal resources to immigrants and undeserved families. And then I started realizing I need a mission greater than this. And I said, you know what, women stay-at-home moms who are going through divorce and are the respondents are at a disadvantage.
When they have spouses who control the money, and they're not able to find a lawyer because they can't fund the attorney. And so my mission became, you know, I could help pro se litigants and stay-at-home moms with how to be a client and how to find a lawyer who will help them bridge that gap, while at the same time having an attorney represent them in a divorce.
Aneta (03:12.898)
Wow, where did you find your passion for this? So I know you are in Colorado, and you are an American, and you also worked as a legal, as a paralegal. So, where did you find your passion to be able to identify these are some needs? And I think that I can be the one who could start this movement.
Fatima (03:38.807)
I found my passion in the midst of COVID and in the midst of the chaos and the division and the polarization. I was banned from Facebook for nine months, and I had a whole legal network on Facebook. And in the midst of that chaos and that division, I started researching literacy and
I said, you know what, I really should run for office and just get involved in the conversation because this censorship is really killing me online. And so my passion became, we women really need to have somebody that can bridge the gap and unite and be the bridge builder and unite voices together in policy.
And bring bold ideas that actually solve problems for women and for children, and not just like talking points and politicians. But we need a leader who can actually bring about the individual voices and not just the mainstream big corporate think tanks.
Aneta (05:01.88)
Who did you tell your idea to? Like, what were you thinking through? who?
Fatima (05:06.88)
I told JW Wilson, and he passed away just recently.
Aneta (05:12.142)
Who was that? Who was JW Wilson?
Fatima (05:13.826)
JW Wilson, he wrote the book Cracked in the Learning Curve. And he says, Marla, you have to like crack your own learning curve and then think differently. And he was the one who was the cause of my movement, building and developing my business idea, and myself. And he actually was the one who recommended Landmark. And so Landmark is the cause of further transformation into professional and leadership skills.
Aneta (05:51.49)
How long have you been in the landmark now?
Fatima (05:54.54)
Since January.
Aneta (05:55.919)
Okay, and it's been impactful as you see. Yeah, I know a lot of people through Landmark, and they seem to stay in like lifelong learners as part of
Fatima (05:58.102)
It's been intense. Yeah, because it's like a constant shift. And so you're constantly transforming and shifting, and you're realizing your blind spots. And so that transformation is like, it really causes you to get to know yourself.
Aneta (06:30.614)
Yeah, so good. And one of the things you also talked about is that you're committed to leading from joy instead of survival and listening more than hustling and really embodying the piece that you want to bring into the world, that you want to see in the world. So how do you plan to do that? Or how are you currently doing it today with all the work that you're doing?
Fatima (06:40.108)
Yes. Okay, let me think for a moment. I'm naturally joyous. I think I view life, my cup is always full. And so I bring out when I'm out and about, I bring out that energy of happiness wherever I go, and I don't let people shrink me. And COVID kind of caused a little bit of a backtrack. And so I had to heal from traumas, past traumas, to reclaim my identity and understand who I am. So I'm always pretty enthusiastic and joyous. And I bring that about wherever I go. And people are always saying, you're so energetic. I like your energy. And I keep that energy so that it keeps people from being negative. I don't know, joy is just something that you're, when you have peace, you have joy.
And when you're not looking to win and lose and compete with others, you can bring about the joy in others. more than. And also when you're listening to others, and you're just listening, and you acknowledge, I've noticed how others are more receptive towards you.
Aneta (08:46.029)
Yeah, it's, it is a state of mind that we get to embody what we want to see in the world. Then we start to notice that others also respond to that. They feel it. They feel the energetic pull towards it. Were you always this way? Like, did you grow up feeling joyful or having this be modeled for you?
Fatima (09:10.924)
Yeah, I grew up pretty joyful. I'm Cuban. So being from a Cuban background, we we tend to lead from joy and and positivity and we can argue and still it's it's kind of like Marie Forleo where she's always saying that her family, I I don't know if you have her book, but in her book, she kind of like talks about how her family was always like arguing.
And you can hear them arguing in the background. And I think it's a typical Italian thing, just like a Cuban thing, to be arguing and loud. But at the end of the day, you can just get over that and just move on and continue being that peacemaker, that harmony person.
Aneta (10:02.869)
Mm-hmm. And I do want to go back and talk a little bit about the Harmony Movement because I know that in your description of it, it is people-centered, constitutionally aligned, and spiritually grounded to restore integrity, justice, and purpose to public life. So tell me about your vision for this movement.
Fatima (10:24.163)
So my vision is I am going to be the cause for helping people be seen, heard, and restore their integrity, and allowing them to have a speedy trial with dignity. And that's about due process. I believe that in America, the Constitution says that all people, regardless of whether you're legal or illegal,
You deserve due process. And we've kind of lost that vision from the framers in this immigration, this immigration, and with all the immigration happening in the world. and how Trump is trying to round up immigrants and just ship them out. Our courts are bombarded, and they're slow, and we need lawyers, paralegals, and legal professionals to come together to help people have that dignity and due process in the legal industry. And so my movement is more a restoration of dignity, justice, and unity in civic life, so that people get access to justice and legal resources that they otherwise don't have because the lawyers are always just chasing the dollar.
Aneta (11:52.216)
Yeah, what needs to change for this to actually happen?
Fatima (12:00.153)
Lawyers need to start using paralegals a little more for rainmaking, finding clients, and intake. And I think paralegals and bilingual paralegals can actually go out and humanize the situation for lawyers. And they can be, because we're not paid like a lawyer, and we can't do legal, give legal advice, we can sit and listen and truly listen to the person
and take notes and understand their case, and teach those immigrants or the pro seyers how to be a client and coach them to work with their attorney so that they're not always fighting to be heard.
Aneta (12:54.419)
And have you found supporters within your communities or within the, just in the state of Colorado that are joining your efforts?
Fatima (13:04.96)
I have a couple of people, and it's slow, but I'm in the court. And what I mean by I'm in the court is I'm in action every day, five hours a day, meeting with people and trying to listen to them. Yesterday, I had to be careful because when I go into the pro se offices, my presence is so strong that I'm constantly, and I'm very transparent, that they don't want people like me in the pro se offices, actually collaborating with pro seers. And they're missing out because that's exactly what they need. They need people like me, actually listening to them and helping them understand and navigate the legal system so that they can have justice in their case. And a lot of them, when they go in it by themselves, a lot of things happen that go wrong. And not having a legal professional that understands and educates them on how to think for themselves to be a lawyer or how to navigate the legal rules and understand them, from not even a legal professional, not giving advice, but helping them use tools like ChatGPT to understand and strategize their case, is something that's not available to them. And so where I come in is that I can actually help them. Look, this is a rule: grab your ChatGPT, ask ChatGPT these questions.
And then see where it lands for you and how you can use that to argue your case without giving legal advice. And ChatGPT won't give you legal advice, but it will mirror for you what you need to do. And it will even teach you. I could even teach them how to use it to think like a lawyer.
Aneta (15:23.606)
Interesting. Wow, that's really interesting. And I know one of the things that is part of this is also the movement rights, which you've identified as a missed opportunity, is that people just don't even have transportation services to get to the So what does this look like? Who is providing the rights?
Fatima (15:44.452)
So right now it's still in the works, but I've created it so that I could have, so that as I ride with them, I can actually do the intake and hear their story and listen to their story without just by listening, just deeply listening to their story as I'm driving with them and just asking them basic questions as you're asking me. And so I envisioned something like Elon Musk's vehicles, where you don't even need a driver. And I envision eventually having cars that drive themselves to court. But in the meantime, I can do the legal clinics and provide them with safe rides. I haven't really started it yet. It's still in the works because I don't want to do it myself, and I'd like to hire people who will do it, or maybe even lawyers who ride along with the driver and can give legal advice at the same time.
Aneta (16:50.896)
Interesting. And this is on their way to the court
Fatima (16:53.57)
So that one is kind of like on the back burner, just a little bit.
Aneta (16:56.25)
I think you've identified some needs and some opportunities and a big vision. And what drives you? Because this is like such an undertaking as I look at it, I see your passion, I see your belief in it, and that you have identified this as a huge opportunity, and then propelled you into running for governor. But what is it that motivates you to get up every single day and say, I'm sticking to the vision even though they're probably set back when there could be things that get in the way.
Fatima (17:36.756)
My values, my Catholic values, drive me, and God is the driver of my mission and my son. And I envision him seeing me as a leader and knowing that he can do the same thing too. And he can lead with his values. And he doesn't have to just survive. He doesn't have to make money the object of desire, but he can make other things, putting people first, the object of desire. And when you put people first, everything turns out better because you're actually being more compassionate, and you're not; it's not something for you, it's not something that you're doing for you, it's something that you're doing for others.
And at the end of 10 years, I'd like to say that I was a cause of helping people be seen who would normally not be seen. Every day, people go through the legal courts; every day, people don't have an attorney. And my son can see me leading that, and it's a legacy. It's not just like, it's not dollars.
Aneta (19:10.257)
Yeah, it's beautiful. And you talk about your faith and that being a major driver for you, how has that helped you in terms of conversation and being more compassionate, listening, really helping to combat the divisiveness that we're seeing in this country as you're talking to others? Because we are so polarized in so many ways.
Fatima (19:14.425)
It's compassion. It breaks my heart that many people don't understand their rights in this country. And it breaks my heart that we might lose our freedoms in a real big way because most Americans, at least 54%, graduate reading below proficiency. And then they're not being taught civic duty, and they're not being taught the Constitution. And many people say, I know the law. know, I mean, I've had literally people tell me, I know everything I need to know about the law, and I'm voting Republican. And I'm thinking, really, in landmark, we are taught that every person has this much knowledge, and there is such a wide circle of knowledge that we haven't even tapped into, that if people would just listen to each other, they'd realize their gaps and their blind spots. Like, for example, the First Amendment, most people think that it's freedom from religion. We're not a religious country. We're a God-centered country.
And the reason I know this is because when my parents came to this country, they had to pledge allegiance to the Constitution to declare themselves American. And what I mean is when you, people, are at the center of society, the very, very inner core, and we circle the constitution. And then after the constitution, we circle different jurisdictions and laws. And we have church laws, we have city laws, we have county laws, we have state and federal laws.
And we also have, then we have the government that we circle, the government, politicians, and our representatives. And those representatives represent every person in this country. And the Bill of Rights protects only natural persons, protects the church, and protects the state.
Fatima (22:15.81)
The main constitution is for the federal government not to overreach in states, the church, and individual rights. And most people don't realize that our rights are being stripped away and given to corporations that are not our fictitious individuals. And many of our state laws actually blur the line between natural persons and corporations.
And now we have AI. And if people don't wake up, those unnatural persons will eventually take over our rights. And politicians, their agenda is towards parties and corporations. And a lot of them, a lot of politicians, they don't listen to the very people that they represent.
They listen to corporations, and they make laws for corporations. In our founding fathers, they never meant for corporations to take over and make laws for us. They meant for us to go and talk to our representatives at the Capitol, at the state level, at the county level, and actually tell them what's so, and say, look, this is what I want. And those representatives, if one person says, don't agree, then they cannot advocate for those laws. And what pains me most is that we don't even care to be in politics anymore. We don't even care to do our civic duty and call our representatives directly and say, we don't agree with that. What are you doing for me personally?
And does this law actually protect me, not the corporation, not the AI? Does it protect me and me alone? And we don't even read those laws that they are making for us anymore. And we don't even understand or review them, so when a problem happens, and we have to go to court, like in a family, does that law protect me as a mother? Does that law protect me as a woman? Does that law protect my child?
And many of the laws do not protect us. They protect corporations, and they overreach into our private lives instead of protecting our lives, our liberty, and our pursuit of happiness.
Aneta (25:11.058)
Fatima, if someone's listening and they're just overwhelmed by the how? they want what's the first step that they want to take? How can they get involved?
Fatima (25:23.31)
They could call me directly, and they could go to Fatima Fernandez for Colorado.com, but it isn't. I am still working on that website because I have five organizations, and they can reach me directly at info at Fatima Fernandez for Colorado.com and just directly ask me how I can help. And I will teach them how to lobby for themselves. I will teach them civic duty. And I will teach them how to use AI to defend their rights.
Aneta (25:57.971)
Perfect, wonderful. And I ask everyone a final question, which is, what does it mean to you to live the width of your life?
Aneta (26:08.388)
What does it mean to live the width of your life?
Fatima (26:16.162)
And that question always gets me. To live the width of your life means living fully self-expressed. Living fully who you are, with freedom, with power, and with full integrity.
Aneta (26:59.698)
Mmm, so good. You just have such a big heart. I love your mission. I love the passion, and I love the big vision that you have for what is possible. And also, I really am. I just respect the fact that you said, I see a need, and why not me? Let me lead this and guide it. Because so many of us sit back and we can complain about things, and we feel like we're a victim of the circumstances. And in your case, you're saying no.
Let's go make a difference, and I'll start first, so follow me. So I wish you continued success, and for those listening, we'll include all the links to Fatima's cause in every way that you can get a hold of her, and I just wish you continued success with everything that you're working on.
Fatima (27:48.987)
Thank you, Aneta.