Episode 10 transcript: Overcoming burnout, redefining success and living with purpos

 Episode 10: Overcoming burnout, redefining success, and living with purpose with Steve Sokany

Podcast Introduction

We often hear people wishing us a long, happy, and healthy life. But what if the length isn't what matters most? What if instead, it's the breath, depth, and purpose of each day that matters most? Welcome to the Live the Width of Your Life podcast. My name is Aneta Ardelian kuzma. Join me weekly as I interview guests who make changes in their own lives to live more fully with intention, gratitude, and joy. Be prepared to be inspired by their stories of how they shifted their mindset, took courageous action, and designed the life that they always wanted to live.

Aneta: Today's guest is Steve Sokany. Steve is the managing director at Carter, a company dedicated to Advancing Philanthropy Worldwide through professional counsel in the areas of fundraising, strategic planning, governance, and organizational development. Steve has over 30 years of experience in the nonprofit sector and has held a variety of leadership positions in higher education and social service Organizations. Prior to joining Carter, Steve spent two years helping to establish the West a hundred 17th Foundation, serving as its first executive director. Additionally, he spent 27 years at Kent State University and a number of roles culminating this tenure as Vice President for Institutional Advancement and Executive Director of Kent State University found. Steve's fundraising council focus, Bill focuses on building donor relationships, strategy development for securing principle leadership and major gifts, communicating compelling philanthropic case statements for donor support, and motivating stakeholders to convert them from friends to funders. Steve has had a strong passion for civic involvement for more than 10 years, he's been an active board member with Moca Cleveland. He also served as the co-chair of the Board of Directors, of the 2014 gay games nine in Cleveland, Ohio. The 2014 gay games, also known as GG nine, were an international multi-sport event and cultural gathering, organized by BI and specifically for lesbians, gays, and bisexuals. And transgendered athletes, artists, and musicians. In his free time, he enjoys traveling, appreciating and supporting the arts, and practicing meditation and mindfulness. Welcome, Steve to the show.

Aneta: Hi Steve. Thanks so much for joining me today.

Steve: Hi, Aneta. Great to be here.

Aneta: So, I'm so excited to have you on this show because I have really enjoyed watching your trajectory over the last couple of years. Can you share a little bit more about your background with us?

[00:01:00]

Steve: Sure! I've been involved in higher education and philanthropy. And philanthropy as a career my whole life. That was never something that I had thought that I would get into, but I think, I was a victim of circumstance, and I say that in a positive way. I started in college, working in our alumni relations department, and then, my responsibilities got gradually more intense, and then when I was getting ready to graduate. My boss announced that she was leaving and so her boss called me into his office and said, hey, would you like to take Mary's job? I said I didn't have anything on the horizon, so I said, Sure! Ended up working at my Alma mater for the next two and a half years, and then I saw a position open up. Actually, my sister saw an ad in the plane dealer for a position at Kent State. She basically said, isn't this what you do? You should consider applying for this because it would be great to have you come back to Cleveland and be closer to family. It turns out, I applied for the position and in 1993 started my career at Kent State University and stayed there for 27 years. Obviously, I had varying positions at Kent State and ended up growing in my career as Kent State was growing in its fundraising and alumni relations area. My aspiration had always been to be the vice president of the division. I thought that would be a culmination of everything that I had learned and to be able to be responsible for the division was something. I thought really is what defined me. So that opportunity was presented to me in 2015. While I certainly have no regrets and I'm very proud of all of my accomplishments. I think what I realized after the fact is that I made a lot of trade-offs in order to be in this position and felt that it was my position as an executive officer that really defined who I was rather than what I should have been focused on. So, that was really how I got into this. It was certainly not something that I went to school for, but it was something that I truly loved. But I think my priorities were a little off-kilter.

[00:02:00]

Aneta: I think you're many of us can relate to that. I didn't necessarily also aspire to go into banking but, spent 22 years in the banking space. So when you went to school and take us back as a young adults. When you graduated. What were some of your dream? Did you have any dreams or did you think about what you wanted your career to look like or any specifics about what the future was going to look like?

[00:03:00]

Steve: As I thought about it. It's so interesting. At my first salary, I thought I'm so rich. I have so much money because I went from making minimum wage to this salary. So, the first thing that I did was get a brand new car and I was so excited because that was the first new car that I had. As I went through this and as I thought about it. I guess, the salary always tended to. I thought this is so great. It's going to afford me the opportunity to buy things and do things. I was a little wrapped up, I think in the monetary and as well as probably, the prestige. Even though there were times when I tried to downplay what my position was when I became an executive officer. People would look at me differently. I think as I rose through the ranks of people that had been colleagues of mine. I was now their supervisor and so it was really interesting as I look back in terms of how people regarded me. I just assume that regardless of what position I held. I was still the same person, but clearly, that was not the case. It's only through reflection that I've come to that realization. But, I love to travel. I got to travel all over the country in my job and meet with people that had done very well in their lives. So I got to go to all of the great places and all of the great cities and I thought that that was probably the most important thing and clearly looking back, it wasn't. But, I was young and that was just where I was at in my head, I guess.

[00:04:00]

Aneta: Yeah, I love this idea of many of us sometimes associating our identity with our title or what the job is, especially when we're younger, right? If it's easier to do that. So you said that upon reflection, you realize that wasn't necessary. Who you were? And even the money, which was a strong motivator and it is a top motivator for many. It wasn't necessarily, your top motivator. So take me back to a couple of years ago, because you made a significant change in your life just a few years ago.

[00:05:00]

Steve: Sure! So, having been in the position that I was and I was familiar with the position at Kent State, I had been and I just assumed that I was going to be going, retiring from Kent State and then I'd have a nice pension and just have to live out my golden years. Based on all of the experiences that I had during my tenure that I had at Kent State. But I think, it became very clear, and without going into too much detail, that when you get to the level that I was at when leadership changes at the top, I've always heard the story that they tend to bring in their own people. I felt I guess I was a bit naive thinking, that would never happen to me because I've been this loyal employee for 27 years and I love the university just became clear that our vision and goals, and objectives were not in alignment. So separated from the university in a pretty quick way, something that I had not anticipated. It was tough because I had only known that for the last 27 years, and was very comfortable. It was very reliable. So, I really had to figure out what I was going to do. I knew I needed to decompress because as many people would say, including my husband, I didn't see this at the time, but they made comments like you were a heart attack waiting to happen. You were so stressed out all of the time. All I ever did was focus on work. I had no work-life balance, but at the time I didn't see myself that way. I just figured I was doing what I needed to do. But for heaven's sake, getting up at 4:30 in the morning and being at work by 6:00 AM, and then getting home at 8:00 PM at night while I was trying to watch television, still checking my emails and doing work things, and spending time on the weekend. I look back on that and I'm thinking, what was I doing? So then I went from that to when I left my position. I didn't have anything. So it was like, okay, what am I going to do? Fortunately, it was the summertime and I liked to be outside. So, I ended up just relaxing and trying to decompress from all of that. But at the same time, I was trying to figure out, okay, what the heck do I do next? Because I was on a path and I just assumed in five years I would be done with that path and go on to the next chapter and now it was like, okay, now what do I do?

[00:06:00]

Aneta: I know that many can relate to the story. It happens to many people. So what does that look like when you go from maybe running a hundred miles an hour to then stopping? How long did it take for you to decompress or to de-stress or just be able to get yourself to like a restful state after you left?

[00:08:00]

Steve: That's a great question. I would say I did it in phases because I think at first it was just turning off the computer, so to speak, and turning off the emails because there were no more emails coming in. I basically as I think about what I was doing. I basically just stopped. This is going to sound kind of funny or ridiculous. But I just spent the summer at the pool. Just reading and just not thinking about anything and not really thinking about what was next. So it's kind of like I turned off the light switch. I went from being in this high-stress job to all of a sudden nothing. As I think back, it's hard because I didn't really start my journey into wellness. Improving my mental health until the fall. Because I'm like, I don't need that. I'll be fine. And I was probably living in a bit of I don't know if it was denial, but it was all I knew and I just shut it off and I just I didn't even want to go there.

[00:10:00]

Aneta: I remember that summer. So when you took the time off, as you said, shut the light switch off. What did you notice? Did you find that you were noticing things around you? Was your temperament changing? Were you starting to notice small changes in you when you just started to rest?

Steve: I guess, in a way, yes, but I also think I needed to be guided to recognize because I think I didn't have the stress of emails and things, and meetings, constant meetings, and because the months leading up to it was all about zoom meetings. From 7:30 AM to 6:30 PM. It was kind of nice that I didn't have zoom meetings to have to worry about, and I would wake up in the morning and I'd be like, okay, what am I going to do today? which was crazy because I think the other thing that I used to, getting back to an earlier question, used to think when I was young that wouldn't it be great to have a job where your calendar was completely planned out? You didn't have to schedule meetings because meetings were just put on your calendar and you would just go from one meeting to the next old age be careful what you wish for because my time was not my time. It was not my own. I mean, it was so scripted and so planned out that I really didn't have a chance to breathe, so to speak. So in some respects then I had a whole lot of time to breathe, but I didn't necessarily know what I was going to do with myself. So I was thinking, you know, okay, well I guess I could plant flowers, I could weed the garden, I could watch television or, catch up on reading my New Yorker magazines and all of these other things, but I think it was just so abrupt in terms of when the decision was made that I really wasn't sure, and to be honest, I didn't know what the next chapter was going to be. It wasn't until through conversations with you and with my husband. The thought of meditating and having any executive coach and really exploring that I'm like, well, I've done that before. What is this going to do that's any different? Going into it. I was a little pessimistic. I got to be honest, but it wasn't until I really got into it and really it wasn't just an add-on to an already crazy day. It ended up being the focus. I think that made all of the difference in the world in terms of being at the right place at the right time and having that crack of receptiveness. How it would turn out? Then obviously, that crack ended up being the window wide open, so to speak.

[00:12:00]

Aneta: So, tell us a little bit about what happened then in the fall? So you and I did have a meeting. I was actually surprised because you reached out. Because I talked to you before. Because I do to everybody. I always tell everyone they should meditate and some people say, Yeah, yeah, yeah, try that. I have an app. So tell us a little bit about your journey as you started focusing on your personal development and planning what you wanted for your life and also starting to focus a little bit on self-care with things like meditation and mindfulness.

[00:13:00]

Steve: Right. So I think again. I was going into it and I was open to the opportunity. But I really didn't know what to expect. I think it was quite honestly, just having authentic conversations with you. Really beginning to come to terms with what I was really looking for or what I was lacking. I think the one thing that probably and I've looked back over my journals. One of the things that I recall you suggesting that I do early on was to start to journal every day as part of meditation. I remember when I first started the journal. It was pretty probably superficial. I would think that I was just writing things down because that was my task and I was always good at, okay, you tell me something to do and I will do it. That I always prided myself on that. Whereas, as I started getting into this and realizing. I think my journal entries definitely became more substantive. There would be some days that were more substantive than others. But I think that is the journey that we're on. Not every day is going to be a hundred percent. I think I found that with meditation as well. I think at first I had a lot of voices going on inside and trying to figure it out. I thought I was looking for this magic help. Okay, I'm going to start meditation and it's going to be amazing and I'm going to be able to quiet. As I was going through it. I quickly realized there were still voices through the guided meditation to acknowledge it. It's okay to acknowledge it. Not every meditation is going to be a hundred percent. It's a journey. And I really, I think what I found more than anything is that this is not a check-the-box kind of thing. This is a journey and this is something that I'm going to be on for the rest of my life. And so, and I think that when I came to that realization, and I started reading other books that reinforced and I think the first book that I read because it was an easy read, was the Fur Agree and I remember thinking to myself, wow, these are basic tenants, but I hadn't really thought about it. I kept going back and referring to them and I think the more I live those tenants. It made such a difference. And then as I read more things and this is something that I would've never done. I would've never looked at self-help books and meditation books and well-being books. But I just started hungering for those and I remember Matt saying to me, who are you reading these books? And it just became, I've learned so much, and obviously, we can go into that and peel that away a little bit more. But, I think one of the things that I learned in the process that I probably hadn't thought about is the outside Steve everybody thought life of the party, very gregarious, very extroverted. But I did not love myself at all. I was miserable. I think going through this wellness. It helped me one of the biggest takeaways is to love myself now and that I'm so grateful and so appreciative of everything I have even though I had material things who cares about that? That's one thing that I've learned, sure. I live in a beautiful home and I have a lot of beautiful things around me. But that's not what I want to be remembered for. I know we'll maybe talk a little bit about that, but I was so obsessed with that clouded who I was. It was only through meditation and mindfulness that I really came to the realization that my priorities were definitely out, so to speak.

[00:14:00]

Aneta: Yeah. You are so disciplined because I know you’ve always joined meditation almost every single day and you have for the last two and a half years, which is amazing and it's wonderful because I do think that the more you do it easier it is and the routines start to stick. But, we also did some exercises around identifying the different areas of life and your satisfaction. And as you said, maybe on the outside you looked like you had it all going on, and on the inside, there were some, some cracks and some things. Tell me a little bit more about what the exercise of a kind of walking through the various areas of life and defining what a successful well lived life looked like for you.

[00:16:00]

Steve: Well, yeah, I think, I hadn't really thought about all of the different components on the wheel. So as I thought about it. It helped me put the right things into perspective. And I think what I realized first and foremost, and I should have referred to that before I got on this podcast. So just being completely authentic. But I think taking care of myself first and foremost was the priority. Obviously, looking at the relationship that I had with my spouse was very important. Clearly, I wanted to be able to have a certain amount of income, just so that I could do the kinds of things that I wanted to do. It wasn't that it was defining what I needed to do.

[00:17:00]

Steve: I think as I looked at that, I realized that some are going to have different weights than others. That was a very useful exercise. Just knowing, and prioritizing what I wanted to accomplish and what were the most important priorities. I think that really helped me to self-examine that.

[00:19:00]

Aneta: Yeah. I remember lots of conversations about what you want to do next in terms of your career and aligning it with your life values and the things that were most important to you. Can you share a little bit about what it was like to, at your age, after already having such a successful career for several decades, decide what you wanted to do next?

Steve: Well, clearly I wanted to enjoy the profession of philanthropy, and I knew that whatever I did next. I wanted to be passionate about the cause that I was representing because that is very, very important to me, and I also truly believe that fundraising, for example, is an art, not a science and it's all about having authentic relationships with donors and trying to encourage them to make a gift to support a cause. If you can't get behind that a hundred percent of people are going to see. They're going to see through that if you go into sales and you're selling a widget, so to speak people need that widget. So it's not perhaps as important. I mean, you still have to have a lot of the interpersonal skills that I believe I have. But I think for philanthropy, people don't have to give you. Yeah, they may have their tax advisors saying, hey, you need to give money away, but they're giving to a cause that they really believe in and you're their liaison. You're the representative. That connects their passion with a corresponding need. I did always pride myself on my career being able to do that, and I had many people say, wow, you're really good. You got me to come up with the idea to make a gift. Whether it was to fund a scholarship or a building without even having to ask. So I knew that I wanted to continue to do that because that's what I've always done, but I knew that it needed to be for a cause that I could believe in and I could really wrap my arms around. That was absolute.

[00:20:00]

Aneta: So once you decided and set some parameters around it. Did you find that it was easy or difficult to kind of find that next role?

Steve: Well, in the category of being I think timing sometimes is everything but being in the right place at the right time. And I think the other thing that I learned was that people always said, your network, and I never really regarded people as my network because that just seemed so sanitized and unauthentic. But I realized that these relationships that I had built with people. It went beyond. My previous relationship with them. So it was purely by chance that it was getting to the end of the summer. As I mentioned, the pool was going to be closing, so I needed to figure out what the heck I was going to be doing. I got connected to two individuals that were starting up a development project that was going to impact the LGBTQ+ neighborhood and being a neighbor or being part of that I'm like, that's really interesting. I was introduced to them. Did a tour of the facility. They talked about setting up a foundation, and so I just started asking what I thought in my mind were basic questions and they hadn't really thought about it. That was on a Friday afternoon. On Saturday, they asked if I would consider consulting for them. Then I started doing that immediately and then eventually they asked me to be the inaugural executive director. Four months later. So it really was a very seamless process. It wasn't as if I had to update my resume and do interviews. Yeah, it was just a very easy process. And again, as I look back on it, it was the perfect opportunity for me. Because I assumed that I would just go back into higher education fundraising, and I would probably reach out to a head hunter because they had been approaching me all the time and I just thought that that was what I was going to do and this was something very different.

[00:22:00]

Steve: That I had not really done. I mean, we did some projects for two related causes at the university. But not where I would jump in a hundred percent. It was amazing. I truly, again, as I look back and as I look forward to one of the books that were really impactful to me was "Surrender Experiment" by Michael Singer, where sometimes I preface this and I probably shouldn't that if you just let the universe happen the way it's supposed to happen. What you're supposed to be doing is what's going to happen. And I think in this case, this is exactly what I was supposed to be doing. I read another book recently that the world has been around for how long and all of the time that has elapsed billions of years, maybe not billions, but it's, it's a long time has led to where I'm at today talking to you. Right and everything. There's a purpose behind everything. You just surrender to that piece that you can fight it, but if you just surrender to it and let things happen. I truly believe, and I'm an example of this, that the things that are supposed to happen are what happens.

[00:23:00]

Aneta: Yeah, it's so interesting and I have to try not to chuckle because the old Steve would never have said something like this. You probably.

Steve: Absolutely not.

[00:24:00]

Aneta: But I do see it over and over again in my own life and with my clients, that when we decide to open ourselves up to something and we start spending time reading the books, meditating, taking the effort to define what a well-lived life looks like to you? We become more open and we notice things more. Right? That's part of mindfulness and suddenly, conversations were a bit more present and we ask better questions or we develop a good relationship. Or you reach out to someone that maybe you haven't talked to in a while, and all these little synchronicities, right, they start to add up and suddenly new opportunities are available all around us. So I agree with you. I see it all the time and I think it's pretty amazing. One of the other things I wanted to ask you about was, You've just really pushed through a lot of comfort zones the last couple of years. So you started to meditate. You started, I know having some pretty interesting new routines that you established for yourself, focusing on your health.

Aneta: So what does it feel like to constantly be pushing yourself and growing and sort of expanding beyond the comfort zones that you had for so long?

[00:25:00]

Steve: Well, first of all, it feels really good, but I also know what I have learned. Is that, much like I used the metaphor before where I just flipped off the light switch? I still have predispositions and I still have these, internal saboteurs that it's easy to fall back into. But I think the one thing that I have realized is that I begin to recognize that. And that I'm not going to make the same mistake, or, if I see myself going down that path. I recognize it because I tend to again, I tend to think and take things personally. And as you know, through our coaching. I am very much a people pleaser, but at the end of the day, I've got to be happy with myself and I've got to focus on myself. First and foremost, And again, sometimes that's easier than others. I mean, I love to eat good food. I love to enjoy fine wine and other things. I think, you know, I've kind of fallen off the wagon a little bit with respect to walking and, and exercising. I recognize that, and I need to get back onto that because I felt so good when I was doing it, and as you acknowledged earlier, I'm very routinized. Once I build that into my day. I'm very, very, that's one thing I think that has continued through, my journey. I'm very disciplined. Once I do that, I think what I have found through meditation and well-being is, there are times when the old Steve starts creeping in and I'm getting upset about something and I'll just stop and do some breathing exercises, and it totally diffuses the situation. I look at it very, very differently.

[00:27:00]

Aneta: So, so many good things, nuggets here. I love the fact that you're breathing because as we know, our breath indicates how we're doing. If we're breathing quickly, we might realize we're stressed or anxious. And you can also adjust your breathing by breathing deeper, creating more energy, or relaxing. So I love that you're using that. You mentioned something about the saboteurs and that is an assessment that I love doing that identifies. Each of us has self-sabotaging behaviors and creating that awareness for ourselves is so great because then we can catch ourselves in the moment. Especially when we're stressed. So, how has that assessment sort of helping you to be able to self-regulate over and over again when you need to?

[00:28:00]

Steve: Well, I think, as I said, I think I am inherently, and I've done every test imaginable from the disc system to Myers Briggs, to Spark type and everything from when I was in my twenties to where I am now. I am a high eye, so I am an influencer. But I am definitely a people pleaser and the worst thing that can ever happen is to feel like I failed somebody. So, I would always work that much harder because I thought, okay, the worst thing that I can do, is failing or not. And I think that was part of when I got the position to be an executive officer, I'm like, this is the pinnacle of my career. I've achieved this major milestone. But then, part of it is people aren't always, most people when you're at this level. I'll digress for a second. I had an executive assistant that gave me this little book of different mantras and one of them has stuck with me forever has been. It's lonely at the top, but you eat better because it is lonely at the top. People aren't calling you to tell you that you're doing great. They're calling you with problems, and issues that need to be resolved. So it really was a constant. It's day after day, hour after hour. It was putting out one fire after another. What I realized, is that I’m my primary saboteur because I would never want to not be able to solve a problem because if I wasn't able to solve a problem, I felt people would think of me differently. Even though I always said to people, it's okay to make a mistake as long as you've learned from it. I was always the hardest on myself because I never wanted to show weakness or insecurity. So I would just plug away and I see that it does creep up sometimes if things don't go the way I thought they were going to go. I hear those voices in my head again saying, Hey, Steve, you're not pleasing this person. They're thinking perhaps they're thinking negatively of you or they're not respecting you. And most of the time there's no question that's just totally in my head, and that's just the voice telling me that's really not the case. But now I recognize it and much faster. And I also believe that at the end of the day what I know to be my truth is that it really doesn't matter what other people say. It gets back to the four agreements. Don't take things personally. I need to focus on myself. That again is the biggest journey, and the biggest outcome that I've made is just focusing on me. This is why I'm so disciplined with meditation and some of these other things and which is why I have to get back out walking and doing those kinds of things because I want to have a quality of life. I don't want to look at people, and this is not to sound judgmental, but I want to be able to not have a problem getting out of a chair or not being winded, going up a flight of stairs to be able to enjoy things without having to dread, am I going to be huffing and puffing? All of those kinds of things.

[00:29:00]

Aneta: Yeah. No, it's so true. The investments that we make in ourselves really do pay dividends. Short-term and long-term, but especially in the longer term if we're consistent with it. So, Steve, I know you have a lot of passions outside of just your career. You know, travel is a big passion of yours, and also you are on the board of Moca, and so you give love. All things beautiful, as you said, especially art. So tell us a little bit more about how you've created a life that allows you to enjoy things that you're passionate about as well as just work and your own self-care.

[00:30:00]

Steve: Well, I think it's a, it's about setting aside the time to do the things that I'm really interested in and passionate about. We just got back from a trip to Italy. And I think in the past I would've just kind of checking the box, we need to see this, we need to see this. This monument, this piece of art. And now it's more about the quality of the experience. Rather than the number of things.

[00:31:00]

Steve: I will say, one of my first trips overseas. I was in Paris and long story short. We ended up being in the Louv. That's when the Da Vinci code had just come There ended up being a bomb threat, so we had to leave. And so we were all disappointed that we weren't going to be able, to see the Louv. It was probably March. So it was like in the fifties. We ended up going back to where we were staying and there was a little circus in the town square, and we ended up just sitting down and watching these Parisian children, you know, playing in the circus. We would've never experienced that and again, there was a reason that this happened. So it's that kind of quality experience. And I think what I have found when I'm traveling and even when I'm meeting with people that don't look like me or sound like me. I really want to understand what their life is about. And ask, those kinds of questions or look at art and I think about that in terms of modern and contemporary art, which I'm very passionate about.

[00:32:00]

Steve: I love meeting the artists because there may be things that I'm not necessarily going to hang on my wall, but I love hearing about the journey. That they went through to produce something like that. And I think exposing yourself to so many diverse perspectives, whether it's within the United States or in Europe, just helps you realize. We're more alike than we are different. I think that's something that I would've never really thought about. I was just kind of in my little silo. Kind of plugging away, going through life. Now I really look at the quality of the conversation. I would have quality conversations. Don't get me wrong, but I'm looking at things very differently. I've met people that I would've never thought our paths would cross. But again, getting back to the work that I've done, there's an absolute reason why I am meeting this person and I need to learn from them as much as they need to learn from me. It's a shared experience, and I've just done everything that I'm doing now outside of work, whether it's looking at a piece of art or volunteering for something, traveling, or just reflecting outside. I'm looking at it through a much different lens, but it's very purposeful, and everything is happening the way it's supposed to happen.

[00:33:00]

Aneta: I love that clarity and sort of that allowing that you have in your life right now. So you said something, earlier, at the beginning of the conversation where you said that your title and your job are not your destiny, it's not how you want to be remembered necessarily. What do you want your legacy to be or how do you want to be remembered?

[00:34:00]

Steve: It's interesting. So again, I'm reading this book right now. It's From Strength to Strength. It talks about I'm in this phase of my life. Being in my middle fifties and one chapter when I thought about that question. One chapter that jumped out to me in terms of my legacy is At your funeral, what do you want your eulogy to be? Do you want it to be a resume eulogy, or do you want it to be a eulogy of virtues? At the end of the day, some of the examples that were given and it's so, so true. I don't want my eulogy to be focused or my legacy to necessarily be focused on professional accomplishments or titles that I had. I want to be remembered as someone that loved themselves, was a good person, was authentic, and had integrity. That I cared about people and I wanted to help them, and I wanted to make the world a better place. I think the legacy and this would be a totally different podcasts. Just my spirituality rather than being attached to organized religion. I want my legacy to be that I lived my spirituality. I believe, in Christ and was raised a Christian. I want to be viewed as someone that lived that every day. Not just checked the box and went to mass on Sunday. Hopefully, I made an impact on people's lives. I've thought about this a lot. There's always at Christmas time. It's a wonderful life. George Bailey didn't think that he made an impact on people's life. It was only when he was no longer there or never existed. Did he realize the impact? How a lot of people's lives were so much different because he wasn't in there. When I think about it. That I think about I impacted people's lives for the positive I contributed to better things and I made a difference. Again, not by measures of success or possessions or titles, those kinds of things, just by you. Living my best self. That's what I truly want to be remembered as, and that's what I want my legacy to be.

[00:35:00]

Aneta: I love that. Can you tell us who the author is of that book, Steve, that you mentioned? Yes. Cause maybe others want to check that out.

[00:36:00]

Steve: It's Arthur Brooks. Okay. Arthur Brooks. From Strength to Strength. It talks about the whole premise behind it, and not that I'm giving a commercial, but it talks about, you know, the two phases of intelligence that you go through. There's fluid intelligence, the first part of, your life where you know it's all about obtaining and you're contributing back. You take that wisdom and then it's crystallized intelligence and then you're giving back based on your life experiences. And, that's where I feel like I'm, I'm at right now is all of these collective experiences that I have. That's what I want to do in the next chapter use them not to say look at me and you have to do it this way.

[00:37:00]

Steve: But, you know, to get people to think about things a little bit differently, just based on what I've experienced. And it's just been, it's been really interesting. It's been a really interesting, read, and there are so many interesting chapters in there. But that whole two phases of intelligence is what's really at the crux of the book. I've gotten a lot out of it. And again, if you would've told me that I'd be reading these kinds of books, No way.

[00:38:00]

Aneta: Yeah, it's interesting. Sometimes things happen that at the time we may resist and then when we look back we recognize that it may have been a blessing, something that saved us from something else. See all the changes in your life over the last two and a half years, and it's amazing to watch. And I have a final question for you, Steve. So the title of this podcast is Live the Width of Your Life, and it's based on the Diane Akerman quote. So what does it mean to you to live the width of your life and not just the length of it? And how do you do that in your own life?

Steve: So, that's a great question. I think it's really, I think about it and the journey that I've been on, it's about the depth and breadth of the experiences that I have and the relationships that I have and, and the choices that I make. It's not about having although it's good to have a bucket, It's not about, you know, going through life and just checking things off. It's about really looking at those things that are important in your life, the people that you're, that are important in your life. And again, I've said, throughout our conversation. It used to be about quantity. I need to have a party and have everybody that I've ever come in contact with.

[00:39:00]

Steve: Now it's about the quality of the relationships and have the opportunity not just to have a casual, Hey, how are you? But being able to really sit down and have meaningful conversations with people and, you know, when we're traveling, not about, you know, just zooming in and out of a museum, but really exploring. What was going through this artist's mind when they were creating this?

Steve: It's looking at it much. In some respects, holistically and just taking the time, not rushing through. I think that what it means to me is not rushing through and just looking at quality and looking at the depth and breadth of everything that I'm doing.

Aneta: I love it. Love it, love it. Beautifully said. Thank you for joining us today. I am so grateful and I know that the story is going to be inspiring to those that have an opportunity to listen. If you are listening today, please like this show. Rate it, share it with friends share the message, these positive, positive inspirational stories, and of course subscribe to be notified when new episodes are available.

[00:40:00]

Aneta: Thank you, Steve, and look forward to having you back in the future. You could tell us a little bit more about your new adventures.

Steve: Sounds great! Look forward to it. Thanks, Aneta.

Aneta: Thank you!

End.